Interviews with Dr Chauhan

December 17, 2014

Dr. Dinesh Chauhan is interviewed by Dr. Rina Dedhiya about the Case Witnessing Process and refinements made to that method.

Part I: Travelling to a state of order, from effort to effortlessness in seeking the individualistic expression

RD:   Hello, Dr. Dinesh Sir. Thank you for taking time to share with us today and connecting with the Hpathy audience. It has been a long journey since Sept. 2012 when you were last interviewed for Hpathy. At that time we spoke in length about the 3 steps of the case witnessing technique. How has the journey been so far?

Dinesh: Hi, Rina, and a big hello and healing hugs to all of you reading this interview. It is my pleasure to reconnect with all of you today. Let me begin with a story, a story which I was reading today, a very ancient one, that just so aptly fits what I want to share today.

The story goes like this: “In a province no rain had fallen for a long time – everything was dried up. At last the citizens decided to fetch the rainmaker. A deputation was sent to see him in the distant town where he lived, with the urgent request to come as soon as possible and make rain for their parched fields. The rainmaker, a wise old man, promised to do so on one condition, that he was provided with a solitary little cottage in the open country where he could withdraw by himself for three days – no food or drink would be required. Then he would see what could be done. His requests were met.

On the evening of the third day abundant rain fell, and full of praise, a grateful crowd made a pilgrimage to his house and exclaimed, “How did you do it? Tell us.” “It was quite simple,” the rainmaker answered. “For three days all I did was to put myself in order. For, I know that once I am in order, then the world will be in order, and the drought must yield place to the rain.”

Beautiful isn’t it Rina? The whole story brings me down to this understanding of the 3 steps in more and more depth, the steps of the case witnessing technique that I designed from being passive, scientific to active intuition.

In these 4 years I have come to perceive the universality of these 3 steps in more and more depth. I have started applying these 3 steps in my daily life, in my practice, in all the phenomenon that come into my consciousness; everything boils down to a state of intense systematic effort to a state of effortlessness.

RD:   How can one understand this, the state of effort to effortlessness, and put it into practice, especially in understanding a human being?

Dinesh: Yes, let me explain this clearly, about effort to effortlessness, with the help of Guerdigeff’s 3 steps as “the law of three”. This “law of three” is one of the fundamental laws of the universe as three forces- Active, Passive, and Neutral. It is the basis of all the structures and processes within the universe and man. Now applying this law to any phenomenon in nature we can see that discovery of every phenomenon in nature moves in these 3 steps.

• • The 1st step: In the first step we commence with a open ended effort; it is a scientific logical effort. In this initial stage for any phenomenon in general the effort within a set pattern of a system, but all the elements seem to be non-coordinated, not connected. In the first step you are just putting out intense efforts and following the set steps in the system.
• • Step 2: eventually as you are putting effort you see coordination and connection is initialized, as we continue to apply scientific logical effort. Gradually the different scattered but peculiar elements of the phenomenon start aligning, and this is the beginning of coordination and connection, and now your complete focus is in just that centre where everything has started to coordinate.
• • And you gradually move to step 3: At this stage the initial effort turns into effortlessness and you know that you are now putting in effortless intuitive effort, and all the elements in the phenomenon start getting coordinated and connected into a meaningful whole.

While understanding a human being during your consultation, when you apply these 3 steps, what you do is, you first systematically go through every aspect of the patient’s life where everything seems non-coordinated and not connected, but slowly as you go deeper, you start seeing a peculiar expression wherein everything starts getting connected; then as you focus on this peculiar expression, everything from the centre to the periphery just falls in place and the entire centre of the patient is in front of us.

RD:   During the last interview you spoke about the law of holism and individualistic expression at the holistic level in relation to the 3 steps of the case witnessing process. Is this what helps you to go from effort to effortlessness in a case?

Dinesh: yes true, since last time this concept of the individualistic expression at the holistic level has evolved further, and grown leaps and bounds. Last time I explained that in a patient you will observe peculiar expressions coming up at the local level, general level and holistic level, but there will be certain expressions which you would find are common to both mind and body, common at the local level, mental general or physical general level, or holistic level, and this is the individualistic expression at the holistic level, where the mind and body are connected. This individualistic holistic expression is where all the central and the peripheral expressions will connect to a single whole, and this individualistic holistic expression of the patient, must match with the individualistic holistic expression of the remed. This defines to us the similimum.

But taking this concept of the individualistic expression further, applying the universal law of holism “what is true for a part of the system, is also true for the whole system” if the individualistic expression at the holistic level is true in finding the center of the patient, in finding the similimum, then it also has to be true in all aspects of homeopathy. Hence I started applying that in understanding the old classical materia medica or the new materia medica, in understanding the provings, in the follow up criteria, in repetition of the dose. Hence the individualistic expression is a pivotal point where the entire science of homeopathy rests.

Whether we are talking about the core, genetic code, the sensation, the state, nucleus, synthesis, synthetic, the verb, from the Grand generalization till the Genius etc., etc,. when we go into the depth of it, we shall find that it is nothing but individualization at the holistic level. The observation of individualistic expressions at the holistic level is the long sought missing link between the classical Hahnemannian school of homoeopathy and the contemporary classical school of homoeopathy.

RD:   The individualistic expression at the holistic level is true for all the systems and different methodologies that have come in homeopathy, the school that you belong to, the sensation system, speaks about synergy. What about that?

Dinesh: Again I would say that the concept of synergy is the one that is nothing but that which is based on the individualistic holistic expression. Let me explain it to you. Every journey begins with the symptom. We get a group of local symptoms and general symptoms which are not connected and coordinated initially, then as we go further we observe that certain groups of symptoms are those that are common at the level of mind and body. We therefore understand the individualistic holistic symptoms; it is the master key or the chief anchor of the case. As we explore this we come to the center of the patient, where eventually we understand the “Genius” of the patient.

Hence, after understanding the “genius of the patient” my search of the remedy will also be based on those PQRS symptoms, rubrics, keynotes, themes present in the case which have connected to the individualistic expression in the case. Depending on the case my search of the remedy will be either through materia medica, or repertory or thematic materia medicas. For example, if in a given case very peculiar keynotes of the remedy have come up which have connected to the individualistic holistic expression, then I would use the various materia medica books to search the remedy. But if in a given case there are peculiar rubrics that have come up in the case that have connected to the centre, then I would use the repertory tool to search the remedy. If a good thematic description of the remedy has come up, wherein the patient has connected his entire experience, or centre to a particular source, then my search of the remedy will be a thematic prescribing. In some cases there will be rubrics, prominent keynotes from materia medica and a good thematic understanding will also be available. Here I will search the materia medica and repertory to find out the genius of the remedy.

Depending upon how the whole system in a given case interview comes up, the entire system of the search of the remedy will evolve. The system itself will be individualistic varying from case to case. If in a case the prominent rubrics have come up, then the search of the remedy will be using the various sources from where rubric search can be done, the system of rubrics like the various repertories available. But if in a case prominent materia medica keynotes have come up, then the search of the remedy will be using the various materia medica sources. If the kingdom, subkingdom and miasm are prominent in a case, then the search for the similimum will be accordingly. Hence the whole system is individualistic.

Here we see a synergy in a true sense revolves around the individualistic expression at the holistic level, where the individual tools available to us, come together in the most appropriate way to give us the similimum.

RD:   Beautifully connected sir. Indeed, we see synergy in a true sense from symptom to system to genius at the individual level to the synergy at the whole homeopathic level. With this let us now conclude the first part of the interview to see how the scientifically intuitive case witnessing process has evolved in the last 3-4 years.

Part 2:  The Scientifically Intuitive Case Witnessing Process the further journey

RD:   In the first part we spoke about the significance and evolution of the individualistic expression at the holistic level. How has the journey of the scientifically intuitive case witnessing process progressed further?

Dinesh: Yes, in any science we see evolution, so also the scientifically intuitive case witnessing process earlier which I applied in my normal cases. I started applying the 3 steps children cases as well, infact it is through the child centric case witnessing process that my understanding of the 3 steps enhanced further. As the child’s energy is pure and with minimum defenses, the journey through the 3 steps helps you to easily reach the similimum.

(For further details refer to Dr. Dinesh Chauhan’s book “A Wander with a little Wonder” – The Child Centric Case Witnessing Process”

RD:   Previously you mentioned “what is true for one part of the system is true for all other parts of the system”.  Then what about cases like non-verbal cases, cases with deep irreversible pathologies, pathologic cases, cancer cases, geriatric cases, cases of loosing memory (merge with geriatric) coma cases, etc.

Dinesh: Yes, the same questions remained with me for a long time. As I started getting these kinds of cases, my technique refined further, like in non-verbal cases, especially in children who haven’t developed speech, in children with pathological conditions like cerebral palsy, MR, autistic children, in such cases I would concentrate on 5 areas:

1. 1. Physicians observation
2. 2. Parents observation
3. 3. Mother’s History during pregnancy
4. 4. Physicians examination findings
5. 5. A pattern that is running through and through

In such cases these 5 points prove of utmost importance. The peculiar expressions which come up spontaneously and naturally in two or more than two areas from these five areas, will be nothing but the individualistic expression at the holistic level.  This will be considered highest in the totality, as this will be that expression which is running through and through, and the other peculiar expressions will be placed accordingly in the hierarchy of the totality of symptoms.

RD:   What is the significance of concentrating on not only a single point but these 5 points together?

Dinesh: If we take only any one of these points into consideration it would give us a one sided picture. If we consider only the physicians observation then it would be his opinion. If it is the parents observation only, then chances of it being biased are high, or it will be only their side of the story. Therefore if we concentrate on getting a pattern which we observe is common and running through and through in everybody’s observation in more than 2 areas, then chances of going wrong will be less and chances of getting peculiar symptoms higher, chances of getting a holistic picture will be higher, or chances of getting individualistic expression at the holistic level higher, and chances of reaching the correct remedy will also be higher!

All these taken together form the totality of symptoms which leads me to the appropriate similimum. Thus the individualistic, holistic pattern can be perceived; and the confluence of the thematic understanding, the rubrics, and the Materia – Medica presents the similimum to me.

RD:   Here you differ from the conventional 3 steps of the case witnessing process, which is the passive, active, and active-active?

Dinesh: Yes Rina, in such cases I will have to break the barrier of following in a certain fixed pattern the passive, active and active-active. Rather I use the same 3 steps in a more enhanced manner. These 5 points act like 5 different areas in the patient, so I become active and explore the 5 areas, find the common thread running through and through and then become active-active and explore the individualistic holistic expression in search for the similimum. It is applying the same principles in a modified manner to suit the case.

 

 RD:   Very true, then would you apply the same 5 points in non-verbal cases, for instance coma cases?

Dinesh: Again, in such cases also we cannot rely only on any one area; in such cases also I explore many areas, like:

1)     Physician’s observations

2)      Relatives’ observation

3)      State or words of the patient (verbatim) before he went into coma

4)      Past history by the relatives,

And that peculiar expression which is running through and through will bring us to the individualistic holistic expression.

RD: Could you elaborate on the state of the patient before he went into the state of coma?

Dinesh: I knew that question was coming Rina!! If you understand the whole condition of coma, before going into this deep comatose state, the entire state of the patient would be aggravated, and it will be right on the surface, like an acute situation or an acute disease condition. Due to the suddenness and intensity of the whole acute disease, there is an acute aggravation of the whole altered pattern of the patient, and hence without any defenses the disturbed state is right in front of us. Similarly just imagine how disturbed or aggravated the state of the patient must be before going into such a deep pathology or comatose condition. Hence patients last words or gestures or state “AS IT IS” expressed by him or her before going into the state of coma would also give us an important clue to his similimum.

RD:   A very valid point indeed. With such deep pathologies, one really wonders how to prescribe in such cases. Naturally the next question that comes to my mind is, how do you apply the case witnessing process in deep irreversible pathologies like cancers?

Dinesh: The very nature of such irreversible diseases like cancers is such that one is overpowered by the whole disease condition. It affects the psyche of the patient to such an extent that it creates its own impression on the patient.

If you understand the irreversible disease conditions, they can be divided broadly into 2 categories, one type is where there is degeneration of tissues and cells, while in other there is uncontrolled proliferation of abnormal cells. Either the destructive degeneration or the uncontrolled proliferation which is the pathophysiology of such cases, gives rise to specific symptomatology which is expressed by the patients.

In diseases like cancer, where there is uncontrolled proliferation, the altered cells, though arising from the normal tissues, represent an altered pattern at the local level too. Also the pace of the growth of these mutant cells is extremely rapid –growing at such an alarming speed the tumour carries a distinct energy within itself. In fact, as the magnitude of these rapidly growing altered cells increases, their unique characteristic energy creates a superimposed state on the individual. So the patient’s central disturbance leads up to this disease, but the disease itself produces a corresponding and definitive disturbance on the patient, which can be termed as the“PRESENT PREDOMINANT PATHOLOGICAL STATE”.

So when an individual suffering  with cancer comes to me for his interview, he will express his state through the smokescreen of this Present Predominant Pathological State, making it difficult for me to get the original altered state, as the whole disease state itself is so dominant in the patient. In such cases, the whole organism is under severe strain, so along with the present predominating changes, the innate holistic state of the individual is also aggravated.  Hence giving only the remedy based on the Present Predominant Pathological State will not help sufficiently and there is a need for bringing in an individualistic holistic approach here as well to deal with the present predominant state.

RD:     You mean there would be 2 distinct states in a patient with such irreversible pathologies, one the constitutional state and other the pathological state? Are you are suggesting 2 remedies?

Dinesh: This is not going against the true classical homeopathy. You know for example that during pregnancy, the mother experiences certain sensations, emotions etc. which they have never experienced before. Their state is different from their normal state. This is nothing but actually the state of the child inside;  it is a different state from her own state, but this doesn’t mean her own state is suppressed. Actually both these states are running parallel to each other; a new state is expressing itself. Here the child’s state is expressing itself through the mother…like the two states are running parallel to each other.

Similarly imagine an external strong situation outside, like the 9/11 disaster or the Tsunami which affected the masses. The sudden impact of the strong situation shook everybody experiencing the catastrophic situation. It left a deep impact on even those whose susceptibility was normal, hence the external strong situation caused its impression on them. The people affected by this strong external situation suffered from a strong external state different from their own state. Even if the susceptibility is normal they suffer from this external situation which has caused an impression on them. Therefore we see 2 states running parallel to each other; one is the constitutional state, and other is a present pathological state.

So here I am saying that instead of giving 2 remedies based on a protocol, like some physicians give 2 remedies, one which is like an organ specific or pathological remedy and other one is the constitutional remedy, there is no protocol as such here. We explore both the states completely, the pathological and patient’s constitutional state and give the remedy on the state which is predominantly running right now. That is why the case witnessing process becomes all the more important. As we explore both the states in the patient, we see what the patient is putting in the centre, which is troubling him the most, and accordingly prescribe, according to what the patient has kept in the centre. We decide whether to give 2 remedies or a single remedy.

RD:   This indeed is a new outlook to irreversible pathologies that makes sense. Now that we are talking about such cases, what about failure cases, or cases in which the remedy hasn’t acted well?

Dinesh: To call a case a failure, I first would question myself about how would that be termed as a failure case. There are cases which haven’t improved at all mentally, physically, or holistically and I see no shift in the patient after 2-3 months of the treatment, or the remedy has acted partially and the improvement comes to a standstill and in one sided cases, where focus had come in only one area, that is it is not a holistic focus, and I am not sure of the remedy, etc. Such cases usually I consider for reassessment.

RD:   While doing reassessment in such case, how do you use these basic 3 steps differently, as you already have spoken to him first and you will again be taking his reassessment or retake.  How would you be sure that this time you are correct or this time you have understood him correctly?

Dinesh: That’s the same question I asked myself, so the first step of the case witnessing process would be long. I would take a long passive, so my interpretation, my earlier case understanding doesn’t come in place, a long guided passive, wherein I explore all subconscious areas, especially childhood, childhood memories, childhood fears, childhood dreams, incidences which had a deep impact on the person as a child, so I make sure that I get the correct information, and do not miss any area where the focus comes up. Again even if I get a common thread running through will wait for it to come up in different areas, will confirm be 100 percent sure about it, and wait for it in other areas, as well.

In the second step which I call the passive guided,  I will explore the previous history of the patient; here too I will explore only the passive part of the previous interview, as it would be that part of the previous interview which has come spontaneously from the patient and I haven’t put my words or my questions in between, so I will explore all the areas of the passive part of the previous interview to again find out the focus or that individualistic holistic expression, after being sure of the focus would become active and active-active to complete the case.

RD:   Wouldn’t this prolong the time of case taking as we are waiting for a long time in the passive itself?

Dinesh: I have no choice here. I need to be sure to obtain the holistic expression, here too. I don’t depend only on the mind areas or the mental general expressions, but I make sure that there is a definite mind and body connection, especially in physical particulars, physical generals, mental generals, to see if they are connected to the focus; then I would be doubly sure of the focus. This is indeed a very important part of the evolution of the case witnessing process that I have observed in recent times, to obtain the mind and body connection, which drastically has reduced the chances of going wrong in my search for the similimum.

RD:   You are talking about perceiving the individualistic expression at the holistic level in all cases, but what about those cases especially in one sided mental cases, or where the patient is in touch with only the physical or the mental complaints as in psychiatric cases?

Dinesh: A very valid question indeed. The same thing would trouble me when you asked me this, because in one sided cases, the patient is stuck at the local level, and all his description revolves around the same local disease phenomenon. So here I have no choice but to collect all the signs and symptoms at this local level; here I will understand the location, sensation, modalities, concomitants at this local level completely. I will completely explore this local side, and prescribe at this local level only for the time being. But while doing this I will keep in mind that every time the patient comes for a follow up I will make sure that I explore different areas of his life, and make note of the peculiar expressions in those areas, and after every follow up I will observe the thread which is running through and through in all the different areas which I have explored in the follow ups, this will bring in front of me the individualistic expression at the holistic level.

RD:   How will you prescribe when the holistic picture is not available?

Dinesh: Definitely it would be difficult to prescribe when the complete picture is not available, but having said that, what I do in such cases is whatever is available. I would prescribe on that. In my mind I would know that I have prescribed on this level but I would keep in mind that every time the patient comes for a follow up I will explore each area till I reach the individualistic holistic centre of the patient.

RD:   Indeed this was a lot of brain storming, for one interview to cover a whole array of possible different cases. With this we really await to learn in-depth about all the above concepts and many more, through your upcoming book of the advance case witnessing process (temporary title) and let’s see what awaits us in the further part of the interview.

Part 3: The Journey from science to intuition, from system to no system to creating your own system

RD:   In the previous two parts of the interview you have etched the importance of the individualistic expression and how you strive to find it in all your cases, be it of any pathology or any other special types of cases. In order to do true classical homeopathy you said you need to prescribe on the holistic level, and also it is equally true that we need to do the classical case witnessing process at the holistic level, and so we need to do homeopathy at the holistic level.

 

 Dinesh: Yes, true, I have always wanted to design the case witnessing technique in such a way that it should have a universal application, such that it should be useful in all kind of cases, from reversible to deep irreversible progressive pathologies. I should be able to apply it in cases from common cold to cancers to psychological and psychiatric conditions… to make the case witnessing process ageless, which I would be able to apply in both children and geriatric cases. Make it such that I would be able to use the same method in people who can talk, to non-verbal cases, who cannot talk due to pathological conditions or in non-verbal cases who choose not to talk because of a deep trauma they suffered, as in abuse cases. Hence I felt the need to design a method in such a way that applying the case witnessing process or the three steps, whichever condition you explore, the holistic centre should be in front of you.

RD:   Similarly you are applying the 3 steps in acutes too?

Dinesh: Yes, very recently in these past two years I have been closely monitoring my acute cases, and I have developed this whole understanding of acutes, their detailed classification, how I would use the same 3 steps in acute cases, and how acutes act as a window to the chronic similimum as well. This I will soon share through my upcoming book on acutes in a short time.

 

RD:   When we began with the interview, you spoke about the universality of these 3 steps, and how you now apply that in your life also.

Dinesh: I believe that everything in our life right from the smallest to any big event happens in 3 steps, wherein initially we put open ended effort, the result at the beginning is scattered not connected, but we continue the effort in that direction, slowly the scattered and not connected starts coming together and we start finding meaning in it, so we keep going at it, till the whole journey becomes effortless, and finally intuitive. Take for example the art of walking.

When we start walking on a daily basis, the whole process of walking towards health goes through the same process from effort to effortlessness. For me the whole phenomenon of walking is a 3 step process. When we start walking, initially the mind and the body are not coordinated and are scattered. In the mind we have loads of thoughts going on, we are not able to concentrate only on one thing; it’s a mental chatter which starts, so also our body experiences different sensations. Sometimes there is pain in the legs, we are sweating, sometimes we feel our heart beat faster etc, your hands, legs, eyes, in fact there is no mind and body coordination. But as you keep at it, you keep doing it, keep following it in a systematic way, you start feeling that slowly your mind and body start getting coordinated, your mind is focused and your body also is with the whole act of walking, and gradually as you keep at it, you go to a stage where there is complete alignment of the mind and the body, the moment I start walking accordingly, where every system of you starts walking together connecting to a single whole then everything, my whole body, every system of my body starts getting coordinated and then you leave the system; here the whole process of walking becomes intuitive and you can now break the systematic effort that you had to put in and create your own system to walk. You are able to perceive how much you (your mind + your body) need to walk that day, and you can also go into a state of meditative trance and also deal with some mental and physical problems with the help of this awareness which you have attained with walking.

Similarly in my upcoming book “From Treating to transforming Choose homeopathy: A designers approach to your child” I have explained the three steps which I apply in case taking for children, I have recently introduced this new system of diary making (the inner encounter diary) where the child makes notes of his dreams, fears, interests, and hobbies, drawings, and gradually we see a pattern running through and through in his illness, and all his different areas. Soon as improvement sets in. We can eventually guide him according to his inner pattern in his life style, sports, hobbies, study and environment etc.

RD:   You began with the story of the rain maker…

Dinesh: Yes, this is exactly the three step process. Let me complete the story for you all. The first day the rainmaker sat with himself in meditation, he paid attention to every system, all scattered thoughts, dreams, fears, actions, breath. The second day when it all came together he stayed with it and this time he stayed longer in concentration, till everything becomes a part of him, and the 3rd day his whole being was completely connected with the whole of the universe. Now his whole was in tune with the universe and he could make rain effortlessly.

RD:   What would be your message to the reader.

Dinesh: This was my further journey which started with case taking, but this belief that what is true for one is true for all, took it further, from case taking in difficult case taking, to all types of cases to application in my day to day life, in my interests and hobbies in my job etc, this was my big leap

So my message to the reader would be to wish all the readers all the very best, to start your long journey into yourself, start every activity of your life in a systematic way, putting open ended effort, it will be scattered initially, but keep following the system till you start seeing a coordination, the scattered things start coming together in a single whole; once you start seeing a coordination with the whole, keep following it, till you are at a stage where you can now leave the system and create your own system, then it comes to you naturally and spontaneously, moving from science to creating your own individual system.

RD:  Thank you sir, for your insightful wisdom. The whole interview was indeed in a true sense from science to intuition, in 3 steps, where we began with the open ended understanding of the individualistic holistic expression, to actively applying the 3 steps of case witnessing process in various cases, moving to understanding the universality of the 3 steps, and bringing intuition and creating your own system in every aspect of our life.

Dinesh: Thank you Rina. I also take this opportunity to connect with the readers, and request all of them to write to us at Swasthya, through emails and our website. Also you can further read in detail about all the various techniques we spoke about in the upcoming case witnessing book. Lots of healings.

About the author

Rina Dedhiya

Dr. Rina Dedhia graduated with a B.H.M.S degree in 2009 and later obtained her Masters (M.D in Repertory) in 2013. Pursuing her talent as a writer as well, she is currently working on a book on Acute Case Witnessing Process along with Dr. Dinesh Chauhan. She is one of the co-ordinators of all the activities conducted by the ABJF trust. She compiles Dr. Chauhan's articles and cases to have them published in various homeopathic journals.